Delta Green kickstarter

[Tim]

I had read update #2 and I get what they are trying to do and in many ways I agree with it. I don't actually want a lot of crap (I never want a shirt or a mug or a pin - please stop offering those) and I want quality content and I want the creators to get paid and not spend time on things that don't add a lot or any value. So in principle I see what they are doing and I actually do support it and think it will work.

On the other hand I just don't see a ton of personal value for me to back. Using the latest stretch goal as an example they are committing to add a new source book that they will sell. At 128 page they are pricing it as $15 for a PDF which I have to assume will be close to the retail value they will sell on Drive Through RPG so I don't think I will be getting it cheaper. So I am not getting a discount here as far as I can tell.

I don't even get much of a 'I helped bring this into the world' because that ship has sailed as this is not a bubble project.

I don't expect me not chipping in $50 is going to take the wind out of the sails of this monster so very likely the stretch goals will hit and cool stuff will get unlocked with out my help.

I will likely get back in $1 just to watch what is going on. As stated I may jump in at the last minute and either pick and choose some add ons or get in on one of the cheaper All PDF options.

My above counter arguments are not strong, I see that but honesty it is where I am at the moment. I was trying to think about what I would find compelling given their stated model and nothing came up. I guess if they had stretch goals that boosted content of the books (the Dracula Dossier did a ton of this but this is of course directly opposed to their core statement) or maybe were offering some discount on the add ons or maybe offered kickstarter only books that could not be obtained outside the campaign that might work but honestly each of those items has issues and I don't advocate any of them.

[PirateLawyer]

With all due respect Tim I don't understand your chain of reasoning.

You make the assertion that you don't see the value of backing the project "because it will fund anyway". The closest analogy I can draw is that of voting in an election where you assume the outcome is not in doubt; a certain candidate is very likely to win so why vote?

If we take the premise that you are a Delta Green fan and want to see the new DG 2.0 flourish, there's a lot of value in backing the project now, because Arc Dream has clearly stated that they are only going to produce books that are funded via this crowdfunding campaign. If you, and others like you, hang back and rely upon the fact that the project will fund and stretch goals will be reached without your participation, doesn't that have a significantly negative impact on the ultimate success of the game? Don't you want to see as many Delta Green books made as possible (go look at their Google document with all the potential books they have in mind!)? The only logical course of action, in my view, is to plunk down at least for one of the all-digital pledges and monitor how the campaign unfolds. You can always change your mind and reduce it later on.

[Tim]

I am not saying my reasoning is 100% rational exactly mind you but I reject your analogy to voting as this is not a one side wins contest but rather a funding drive.

I was not aware that Arc Dream is only creating books funded via this kickstarter and then folding up the Delta Green tent. Hearing that, honestly I must be much more of a casual fan than I had thought because I guess I don't care that much. I enjoy the Delta Green setting and the books and they have produced are high quality and I will likely acquire all they produce on some time frame (I have pretty much everything they have produced to date) but if they stopped production at some date in the future my life is not that greatly impacted. I can still run and play Delta Green games with out new material and of course there are many and varied games systems/settings that I can turn my attention to.

After thinking about it all day I guess one of the reason I was annoyed was largely internal. I had been waiting for the DG kickstarter for at least a year plus and backed it with in the first few hours of it launching but in examining the list of back rewards and future books I found very little of it held any interest for me and so felt a bit let down. This is childish reaction and I feel a bit sheepish now and I apologize to anyone having to read my rambling in this thread. I fully expect the kickstarter to be very successful and I wish the Arc Dream folks and backers good luck.

[PirateLawyer]

Well, self-knowledge will set you free.

So, who wants to do a death pool?

I think Agent Darren is pining for the fjords.

[clockworkjoe]

If it helps, there's a PDF that clearly lists the rewards now: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/7001919/Matrix.pdf

This Kickstarter will play a huge role in determining how extensive the future Delta Green line will be - all those source books mentioned in the survey a few days back? They won't happen at all if the Kickstarter doesn't reach those levels.

Arc Dream has made it a point to get books out to KS backers before retail customers, plus backers will probably see new versions of the rules before anyone else.

Darren I give 50% of staying there - the game needs some 'old hands' since Alphonse is gone.

Nancy is beyond a doubt feral by this point. She's gone to her people.

Curtis, the leader of the cowboys, is probably a martyr for the cause at this point. His partner is probably leading the charge now.

Matthew is probably alive, but in hiding or otherwise 'retired' - possible adviser for PCs.

Wu is probably high up in the legit organization.

Mason and any other prominent friendlies are probably gone. Too many enemies and too little protection from DG.

[The Lost Carol]

The clarification definitely helps. I'll just need to keep a track of my finances to determine how deep down the rabbit hole I go.

The timeline is a nice addition. With the meta plot being consistent with the previous version that will help make heads or tails of everything.

[PirateLawyer]

Please, Ross, see about persuading Shane et al. to post a somewhat expanded list of stretch goals right at the top of the Kickstarter page.

And someone smarter than me should solve the issue of how pledging $80 for the all-new-pdfs level and plugging in an add-on core book is better value than the $150 pledge 1 for a core book + all pdfs level. I mean, I want to give them a whole heap of money but I'm inherently not going to just give them a bonus $20 for, y'know, reasons.

[clockworkjoe]

Please, Ross, see about persuading Shane et al. to post a somewhat expanded list of stretch goals right at the top of the Kickstarter page.

And someone smarter than me should solve the issue of how pledging $80 for the all-new-pdfs level and plugging in an add-on core book is better value than the $150 pledge 1 for a core book + all pdfs level. I mean, I want to give them a whole heap of money but I'm inherently not going to just give them a bonus $20 for, y'know, reasons.

I'll mention it to him but I think the reward chart needs to be on top.

The pricing mismatch is a result of the Rising Threats reward tier being added later on. I'll ask about what you will get for the extra $20.

[clockworkjoe]

Please, Ross, see about persuading Shane et al. to post a somewhat expanded list of stretch goals right at the top of the Kickstarter page.

And someone smarter than me should solve the issue of how pledging $80 for the all-new-pdfs level and plugging in an add-on core book is better value than the $150 pledge 1 for a core book + all pdfs level. I mean, I want to give them a whole heap of money but I'm inherently not going to just give them a bonus $20 for, y'know, reasons.

I'll mention it to him but I think the reward chart needs to be on top.

The pricing mismatch is a result of the Rising Threats reward tier being added later on. I'll ask about what you will get for the extra $20.

You get the Fall of Delta Green as a PDF.

[The Lost Carol]

Oh look, the new stretch goals are all King in Yellow flavored (and Iconoclasts). What a shock. 

I don't suppose if it all gets funded Ross would run that campaign for RPPR? Finally just giving into Carcosa and going hog wild?

[PirateLawyer]

Oh look, the new stretch goals are all King in Yellow flavored (and Iconoclasts). What a shock. 

I don't suppose if it all gets funded Ross would run that campaign for RPPR? Finally just giving into Carcisa and going hog wild?

I am cursing the currency exchange rates as I keep putting more money into this Kickstarter. 

[clockworkjoe]

Oh look, the new stretch goals are all King in Yellow flavored (and Iconoclasts). What a shock. 

I don't suppose if it all gets funded Ross would run that campaign for RPPR? Finally just giving into Carcosa and going hog wild?

fuck yeah I will

[The Lost Carol]

Oh look, the new stretch goals are all King in Yellow flavored (and Iconoclasts). What a shock. 

I don't suppose if it all gets funded Ross would run that campaign for RPPR? Finally just giving into Carcosa and going hog wild?

fuck yeah I will

Exxxxxxxcellent. By the way, good job herding cats over in the Kickstarter comments, Ross. Things were kinda getting rowdy in the first few days with the confusion it seemed.

[clockworkjoe]

Oh look, the new stretch goals are all King in Yellow flavored (and Iconoclasts). What a shock. 

I don't suppose if it all gets funded Ross would run that campaign for RPPR? Finally just giving into Carcosa and going hog wild?

fuck yeah I will

Exxxxxxxcellent. By the way, good job herding cats over in the Kickstarter comments, Ross. Things were kinda getting rowdy in the first few days with the confusion it seemed.

Thanks. I'm also monitoring threads on rpg.net, SA, and Yog. Social media management yay!

[PirateLawyer]

Thanks. I'm also monitoring threads on rpg.net, SA, and Yog. Social media management yay!

What's SA?