Author Topic: Dig to Victory scenario  (Read 45279 times)

A Scott Glancy

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #15 on: June 15, 2010, 12:34:05 AM »
I posted a link to this thread to Scott's Facebook :D

And why exactly would you do that, Ross? Seems like a bit of a dick move.

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #16 on: June 15, 2010, 02:24:38 AM »
I have stated meny times, I love ASG games for the fact of the history he adds to it. Seriously did you know that people dug under the ground used hearing equipment to try and locate the enameys tunnels? And when they found them, they used punching daggers and other various barbaric tools to kill each other! I mean seriously How could you not enjoy that. Dig to victory was even speed up a bit from what I rember, cause the investagators did not explore all the diffrent areas provided to them. U-boat was long, but anything epic is long.

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #17 on: June 15, 2010, 02:38:23 AM »
I posted a link to this thread to Scott's Facebook :D

And why exactly would you do that, Ross? Seems like a bit of a dick move.

A. Scott Glancy, President TCCorp, dba Pagan Publishing



Really? I just thought you would want to know when the fans are talking about you.

beowuuf

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #18 on: June 15, 2010, 03:26:58 AM »

As Tad says, the long games are not for everyone anyway, especially if the length is alot to do with setting the scene.

However, these are never history lessons on general minutiae of victorian life before the CoC game starts, these are the facinating little known details of how the war was conducted. The conditions of the men who risked their lives, and the shockingly simple or shockingly horrific or incredibly cunning means at their disposal is amazing. I think that if you've got the time to let it wash over you, it provides such a richer set up for the game that follows. It's not delivered dry either, Scott seems to have a joy for the lesser known details and providing them in graphic detail.

Also, there was one point a 'square bullets for the heathens' was mentioned in one of the games. I assumed it had been an old colonial joke. Recently I went to a small naval village in the solent, and saw the gun that did nindeed fire square bullets at healthens!

So yeah, I really love those three APs for many reasons.

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #19 on: June 15, 2010, 04:56:58 AM »
I'm interested in history and being interested in WW1/2 history is kind of inevitable when you're a bloke that enjoyed all those FPSs of latter years. I just felt that ultimately the amount of time spent on talking about the obscure little nugget of history in Dig to Victory was wasted because when the game started to get going I had completely lost any attention I would have put into listening to a game. I don't believe there is a comparison between U-boat Heraus and Dig to Victory on the amount of waffling away from the game and the amount of genuine game time (aided by the length of U-boat).

Tadanori Oyama; you keep missing the point myself and Kroack are trying to make. It is not that the game is long (as I have enjoyed several of the games on this website that can go upto the length of 5/6 hours) but that a significant chunk of the recording is information completely extraneous to the actual playing of the game. In it's delivery it's never really done in a way to set a tone either. For example (paraphrasing a lot here as I don't want to waste an hour of my life getting an example) "They used listening devices to hear where the Germans were digging tunnel and then would react accordingly" could of been said as "The brits were in cramped tunnels, hushed, as they used sophisticated technology to try and locate the burrowing huns." which would of elevated the tension before the game.

Kroack

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #20 on: June 15, 2010, 10:36:00 AM »
In addition I don't think it's just Glancy. I remember both games were played by an assortment of history buffs, who seemed to know a lot about everything.   

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #21 on: June 15, 2010, 12:38:58 PM »
I'm interested in history and being interested in WW1/2 history is kind of inevitable when you're a bloke that enjoyed all those FPSs of latter years. I just felt that ultimately the amount of time spent on talking about the obscure little nugget of history in Dig to Victory was wasted because when the game started to get going I had completely lost any attention I would have put into listening to a game. I don't believe there is a comparison between U-boat Heraus and Dig to Victory on the amount of waffling away from the game and the amount of genuine game time (aided by the length of U-boat).

Tadanori Oyama; you keep missing the point myself and Kroack are trying to make. It is not that the game is long (as I have enjoyed several of the games on this website that can go upto the length of 5/6 hours) but that a significant chunk of the recording is information completely extraneous to the actual playing of the game. In it's delivery it's never really done in a way to set a tone either. For example (paraphrasing a lot here as I don't want to waste an hour of my life getting an example) "They used listening devices to hear where the Germans were digging tunnel and then would react accordingly" could of been said as "The brits were in cramped tunnels, hushed, as they used sophisticated technology to try and locate the burrowing huns." which would of elevated the tension before the game.
In my opinion, the large amount of information helps with further engrossing yourself in the scenario and understanding the frame around which the game is based. It is much like playing Call of Cthulhu set in the 1920s: sometimes you are not sure of some things of that era. A great example of this was during one of my own sessions, where we were not completely sure of whether a gas station in Arizona would have a telephone line in the 1920s. This is coming from a group of RPG players who are not in the U.S.

The information Glancy gave life to the battlefield. It gives characters a very good idea of what trench warfare was really like, how the British military operated and the small details in a soldier's day-to-day life.

Of course, sometimes it is good to simply get to the matter at hand and play the damn game already.  ;D

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #22 on: June 15, 2010, 12:49:40 PM »
I am afraid I must echo the opinions of Kroack and Dogfish. It's not that I dislike long games; in fact, immersion is something I crave and long games are easily the best suited to drawing your players and yourself into the game's world.

I listened to "U-Boote Heraus" and as much as I enjoy Delta Green and Call of Cthulhu, that was a ponderous experience. I thought the story was interesting, but all of the military-based minutiae, going so far as to detail the various U-Boat actions and the proper hailing/boarding procedure, really turned me off from the game. It's not that I hate the military or lack respect for the individuals that have served in the worlds' armed forces, but, seriously: Call of Cthulhu is hell enough. War works fine as a backdrop, but I play games to temporarily escape from the real-life trials of the world.

Perhaps it is hypocritical that I simultaneously crave a fully-fleshed out setting for my games, yet dislike Glancy's presentation of World War I. But I suppose I prefer a setting where real-life humans, perhaps even a few of my ancestors, were never involved. Knowing that the backdrop of the game was the brutal, horrible affair that was the "Great War" made me uneasy, and the explicit detail only unsettled me more.

I am finding this really difficult to convey, and I do not mean any offense to Mr. Glancy or to upset anybody's sensibilities (or engage in a political debate). I just did not enjoy "U-Boote Hearus" due to its "over-realism".
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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #23 on: June 15, 2010, 12:52:55 PM »
Well Dom I'm British myself and wouldn't have an exact answer to the question....but then I would counter saying that it's upto the GM to field questions like that on his toes, making these kind of decisions when play is important over authenticity. The problem with these scenarios is that from what I could tell the tit-bits of knowledge that would of set the mood and would have been useful were blown up into massive sprawling lectures when a couple of sentences would of sufficed. The main problem with it is not that he knew such a wealth of information but that he was laying it on his players, some buffs, some not, without them even having a context to use the information in game.


For example most modules that involve science will have a certain degree of assumed knowledge which is often delved out when a player has to give a response in character when they themselves do not actually know this. A bit like a use of bardic knowledge in D&D for example. That's usually the best way to do it rather than giving people a wealth of information and turning the rest of the game into a pop-quiz.

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #24 on: June 15, 2010, 12:54:45 PM »
Okay guys, maybe learning and gaming aren't for everyone. But when you're running a game for people who have Super Knowledge: Word Wars and you too have Super Knowledge: Word Wars you want to be exact as possible "sophisticated technology" is to vague a term to really bring me into the setting but hearing the descriptions of the devices, the technique and the general mishaps- it does help to immerse me.

I acknowledge different opinions. I, however, derive great satisfaction from the discussions of how the navy guns have the rifle stock. I mean, you can read Al Quiet on the Western front but until you see the weapons you cannot really appreciate the horror. In a world war first scenario revolving around heretofore unbeknownst facts it helps when you're fed background knowledge before and during as to expected outcomes. And for the players, their characters would be familiar with this gear, the stories and the technical aspects so the information is needed by the players in order role play to full capacity.

If I had known all the information about WWI then sure, I'd be board with ASG's thorough discussion of said techniques and technology, but since I don't the APs are exciting. I get to learn about shit I have no idea about and also about how this era of modern war can be made to shine in a horrific new light when you introduce the mythos. Although ASG knows shit tons about the mythos, he doesn't go into length describing the various habits of cultists or bullshit background that is unessential. The characters are familiar with the tech, so i find it helpful when the players and ASG explain it, it helps paint a better picture of what exactly is going on, what tools they are using and so on.

I'm sure that if it was a scenario similar to The Haunting there wouldn't even be the discussion of guns because the investigators might not even have them, there would be discussion of 1920s quirks, cars, immigrants, the social changes, fashion and so forth to help bring the atmosphere alive.

As for spending undue amounts of time describing things, discussing, tangenting, what group doesn't that happen in? This is a special event and you want to make it last as long as possible. The horror at the end of the scenario was not lessened because i learned about how they needed air pumped into the tunnels or that they stored aminol under the floorboards of the barracks, it only heightened the possible doom the players faced. They had gotten underground, where no man dwells using fucking unwieldy tech and not only did they have to survive the Tsthogua sploodge but then get back through their screwy ass tunnels. Sure it took a while to listen to, but it was enjoyed. I listened to it while I landscaped. I listened to U-Boote Heraus while filing away manilla folders and double checking our d-base. I wouldn't trade a boiled down AP for either of the two. There is a pause button, they really don't need to be listened to all in one sitting, and maybe you could take a break during a tangent and get some peeing done or some soda drinking and comeback later and then, since you've been away a while the tangent will help get you back into the WWI mood.

I'm sure people will disagree with what I've said and that is totally okay, but I'd like it to be known that I super enjoy the EPIC APs put forth by ASG and crew.
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Tadanori Oyama

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #25 on: June 15, 2010, 01:05:12 PM »
Tadanori Oyama; you keep missing the point myself and Kroack are trying to make. It is not that the game is long (as I have enjoyed several of the games on this website that can go upto the length of 5/6 hours) but that a significant chunk of the recording is information completely extraneous to the actual playing of the game.

I got that, I just don't consider it a point. I can understand you guys feel differently than me about what you find entertaining and I hope you can understand that what you dislike in these games is exactly what I love about them. I don't want to argue and that's kinda tough when we have totally opposite views on the subject.

It's all guys telling stories to me. The history facts and side stories aren't very different from the "actual" game play for me. It's all pleasant and mentally stimulating.

Dig to Victory is on my MP3 player right now. I've listened to it a dozen times, once on my player's "high speed" setting, which is awesome because not only does it make the game faster but everybody's voice gets high pitched.

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #26 on: June 15, 2010, 02:19:35 PM »
I posted a link to this thread to Scott's Facebook :D

And why exactly would you do that, Ross? Seems like a bit of a dick move.

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That's Ross for you. Always one to provide an opportunity to kick someone else.  :o
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beej

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #27 on: June 15, 2010, 03:02:58 PM »
Quote
That's Ross for you. Always one to provide an opportunity to kick someone else.

Yeah, Ross is a dick.  When he's savagely beating someone, he taunts them, belittles their gamerhood and their family breeding in the Announce voice.   Then he orders Cody to violate with the hapless victim with the o' rusty pelican, then lets Aaron patch up their wounds.  After that he either feeds them to Tom(what with his cannibalistic ghoul tendencies and what not) or lets Bill sell off the poor bastard to some sinister eldrich vendor...one of which turns out to be Scott Glancy.

...I hit all the bases on that one right? 
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Kroack

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #28 on: June 15, 2010, 03:09:12 PM »
You missed Mike using the hapless victim for target practice.

beej

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Re: Dig to Victory scenario
« Reply #29 on: June 15, 2010, 03:18:28 PM »
Quote
You missed Mike using the hapless victim for target practice.

Indeed.

Yeah, Ross is a dick.  When he's savagely beating someone, he taunts him/her, belittles their gamerhood and their family breeding in the Announce voice.   Then he orders Cody to violate the hapless victim with the O' Screaming Pelican or possibly a Rusty Trombone, depending on whether Cody has had relations with a humanoid amphibian recently or not.  Following Cody's abuse, Ross then lets Mike use the poor bastard for target practice and shots him/her from across the room like 'a boss' and then Ross has Aaron patch up broken and humiliated victim's wounds.  After the sexual portion of the ordeal Ross either feeds him/her to Tom(what with his cannibalistic ghoul tendencies and what not) or lets Bill sell off the poor bastard to some sinister eldritch vendor...one of which turns out to be Scott Glancy.

How about that?
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