The Role Playing Public Radio Forums
General Category => RPGs => : Setherick May 05, 2009, 04:39:37 PM
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I started this nonsense on this thread (http://slangdesign.com/forums/index.php?topic=133.30), but have moved it here to keep track of everything. The AD&D state utility can be found here (http://kevinhaw.com/add_quiz.php).
Of course, like all D&D parties, we all met at a shady bar at the behest of someone we didn't know.
Setherick (Me) - The Warlock
STR - 9
DEX - 12
CON - 11
INT - 17
WIS - 15
CHA - 17
Tadanori Oyama - The Cleric
STR - 9
DEX - 9
CON - 12
INT - 13
WIS - 12
CHA - 8
Boyos - The Paladin
Str 15
Int 11
Wis 14
Dex 10
Con 13
Chr 12
Jacen - The Sorcerer
STR 7
INT 13
WIS 13
DEX 17
CON 9
CHA 17
Dawnsteel - The Warden
STR:16
INT:13
WIS:15
DEX:12
CON:11
CHR:7
Dragonshaos - The Bard
STR:7
INT:15
WIS:14
DEX:14
CON:11
CHR:15
Codered - The Paladin
str 13
dex 13
con 15
int 14
wis13
cha 13
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It's kinda sad when you don't even meet the stat requirements to have a class. But it keeps life simpler at least. Still, guide is my kind of job. And I'm at least a side step from "henchman".
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It's kinda sad when you don't even meet the stat requirements to have a class. But it keeps life simpler at least. Still, guide is my kind of job. And I'm at least a side step from "henchman".
hey man, in AD&D, the best characters were the ones who exceeded the expectations of their stats. Besides, you qualify for fighter, thief, mage and cleric (they require only a 9 in the primary stat)
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hey man, in AD&D, the best characters were the ones who exceeded the expectations of their stats. Besides, you qualify for fighter, thief, mage and cleric (they require only a 9 in the primary stat)
Really? I never played AD&D. Cool. Well, I'll stick with guide, give the everyman a shot.
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It's kinda sad when you don't even meet the stat requirements to have a class. But it keeps life simpler at least. Still, guide is my kind of job. And I'm at least a side step from "henchman".
hey man, in AD&D, the best characters were the ones who exceeded the expectations of their stats. Besides, you qualify for fighter, thief, mage and cleric (they require only a 9 in the primary stat)
Don't less Ross fool you. AD&D is an unforgiving whore if your stats are the least bit weak.
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Here's mine. What classes do I go good with?
STR:7
INT:15
WIS:14
DEX:14
CON:11
CHR:15
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I forgot to state my class, haha, fighter works fine, but im gonna go with pally and help the warden tanking! ill be a pally of the raven queen, with raven queens blessing so when i kill a monster ill be able to let somone in the group spend a healing surge, and lay on hands to help heal up a bit.
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Here's mine. What classes do I go good with?
STR:7
INT:15
WIS:14
DEX:14
CON:11
CHR:15
high wisdom... cleric or paladin
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Here's mine. What classes do I go good with?
STR:7
INT:15
WIS:14
DEX:14
CON:11
CHR:15
high wisdom... cleric or paladin
ooo, High INT and CHR, I can be a Bard! Woot, singing ma tune and playin ma lute.
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STR:9
INT:15
WIS:10
DEX:6
CON:7
CHR:12
Lame stats are lame. I'm thinking is Wiz time.
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Here's mine. What classes do I go good with?
STR:7
INT:15
WIS:14
DEX:14
CON:11
CHR:15
high wisdom... cleric or paladin
ooo, High INT and CHR, I can be a Bard! Woot, singing ma tune and playin ma lute.
forgot about bard. that too is a good choice. almost have a full group all we need is a healer and a thief.
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I'll play Cleric. Can't promise to be good at it, of course.
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Thread updated!
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hmmm I would guess I'm a palidin since I'm lawful good
stats are
str 13
dex 13
con 15
int 14
wis13
cha 13
....meh
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I'll play Cleric. Can't promise to be good at it, of course.
completely forgot you were our cleric, my bad. well if we really need I can play the thief. now we just need a DM.
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I'll play Cleric. Can't promise to be good at it, of course.
completely forgot you were our cleric, my bad. well if we really need I can play the thief. now we just need a DM.
Not sure how my Warlock is going to fit in with two LG PCs either. :D
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I'll play Cleric. Can't promise to be good at it, of course.
completely forgot you were our cleric, my bad. well if we really need I can play the thief. now we just need a DM.
Not sure how my Warlock is going to fit in with two LG PCs either. :D
just gonna need to take the "hide alighnment" ability and have a really high persuasion. wait didn't 4E introduce good warlocks? I know I sound like a tard but I could of sworn Ive seen one somewhere, it may of been a prestige class.
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Warlocks can be any alignment, as long as you revere a diety related to it (good = good, lawful = lawful, unaligned = anything, and anything = unaligned)
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I'll play Cleric. Can't promise to be good at it, of course.
completely forgot you were our cleric, my bad. well if we really need I can play the thief. now we just need a DM.
Not sure how my Warlock is going to fit in with two LG PCs either. :D
My wisdom is 12. Your charisma is 17.
Lie to me. I'll believe you.
I like this physically subpar, only slightly educated cleric thing I've got going.
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This woeful ignorance of AD&D displeases me. Back in the day, stats were different back then. Characters were limited to a MAXIMUM of 18 in any given stat, with a possible exception of some demi-humans getting a 19 in a stat. And an 18 in ANYTHING was fucking AMAZING. Characters with a 18 Wisdom were immune to low level illusions. Fighters (and only fighters) could roll exceptional strength if they had an 18 strength. This could give them ogre strength at level 1, with a +3 to hit (which was incredible) and a +7 to damage. If a character managed to get a 19 Constitution, they could fucking REGENERATE.
Any character with a 16 or higher in their class primary stat got a flat 10% experience point bonus. Because that's how we rolled back then.
What I'm saying is: The shit was very real back in the day.
Check out this recreation of old school D&D called OSRIC http://www.knights-n-knaves.com/osric/
This isn't exactly the same but it's close. If you are going to call yourselves AD&D characters at least use OSRIC for stats.
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What I'm saying is: The shit was very real back in the day.
3d6 and hold them. I once played a character whose highest stat was a 10 ... he just qualified to be a thief. Yeah, a thief. No politically correct "rogues" back then. We were what we were.
CR
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This woeful ignorance of AD&D displeases me. Back in the day, stats were different back then. Characters were limited to a MAXIMUM of 18 in any given stat, with a possible exception of some demi-humans getting a 19 in a stat. And an 18 in ANYTHING was fucking AMAZING. Characters with a 18 Wisdom were immune to low level illusions. Fighters (and only fighters) could roll exceptional strength if they had an 18 strength. This could give them ogre strength at level 1, with a +3 to hit (which was incredible) and a +7 to damage. If a character managed to get a 19 Constitution, they could fucking REGENERATE.
Any character with a 16 or higher in their class primary stat got a flat 10% experience point bonus. Because that's how we rolled back then.
What I'm saying is: The shit was very real back in the day.
Check out this recreation of old school D&D called OSRIC http://www.knights-n-knaves.com/osric/
This isn't exactly the same but it's close. If you are going to call yourselves AD&D characters at least use OSRIC for stats.
Ross is such a joykill.
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Ross is such a joykill.
Well, I mean, it's really our fault for having fun the wrong way and everything.
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Ross is such a joykill.
Well, I mean, it's really our fault for having fun the wrong way and everything.
I texted him earlier about if he was so concerned he should run an AD&D game pbp, which somehow ended up with me agreeing to run a 4E (after I buy the books) New World Shipwreck Utopia game...so look for recruitment threads.
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Ross is such a joykill.
Well, I mean, it's really our fault for having fun the wrong way and everything.
You guys are missing my point. Don't be all "oh woe is me, my highest stat is a 15" or whatever. If you were a AD&D character, you would WEEP TEARS OF JOY for having a 15 in ANYTHING. You would all make KICKASS adventurers in AD&D.
I mean, read the example session presented in OSRIC. The game was very life or death, even at level 1 and you needed every single advantage you could get just to make it to level 2.
Background: A party of stalwart adventurers, consisting of
Hogarth, human i ghter and party caller (player: Bob), Alice,
human magic user (player: Mary), Friar Chuck, human cleric
(player: Chuck), Groin, dwarf i ghter (player: Jason), Floppinjay,
elf thief (player: Eric), and Hap, normal man mule-tender
(NPC). They are searching for a way down to the ancient ruins
of the Temple of the Serpent-Men, long sought and thought by
most sensible folk to be only a legend until a recent earthquake
opened a deep crevasse and turned up some unusual objects
of unmistakably ancient origin.
gm: After a couple hours searching through the foothills and
scrubland to the south and west of the crevasse you’ve come
across something interesting—a small cave-entrance with a
shallow stream l owing into it and evidence of foot trafi c go-
ing both in and out. The cave entrance is approximately 100
yards west of the crevasse where the ruins are. It’s now about
noon.
Bob: Can we tell anything about the tracks—what made them?
How many individuals? Do the tracks appear fresh?
gm: Whatever made the tracks was about man-sized and
wearing shoes or boots. You’re pretty sure there were multiple
individuals, not just one person going repeatedly in and out,
and most of the tracks appear fairly fresh. You can’t really tell
anything beyond that without a ranger or other woodsman-
type.
Bob: Okay, the elf will go down into the cave and scout it
out.
eric: Why me?
Bob: Because you’re a thief so you’re sneaky and less likely
to get surprised by any monsters that might be lurking down
there, and you’re an elf so you can see in the dark.
eric: Okay, then, I do what he says—cautiously enter the cave
with my sling out, making sure not to step in the stream. What
do I see?
gm: The cave-entrance is about 10 ft wide and 8 ft high and
descends gently as it winds to the north and east. About 30 ft
in it turns to the east so you can’t see beyond that from where
you’re standing. It appears to grow narrower as it goes deeper,
so if you’re going to keep following it, eventually you’re going
to have to be standing in the stream.
eric: Do I hear anything?
gm: [rolls] Just the sound of water dripping and splashing
on the rocks.
eric: I’ll cautiously move up to the eastward turn and look in
that direction—what do I see?
gm: Beyond the curve the passage keeps descending and
narrowing, and winding in a northeasterly direction. You can
see about 40 ft farther, by which point the passage has nar-
rowed to about 4 ft wide and 7 ft tall, i lled entirely by the
stream.
eric: Okay, from where I’m standing I poke into the stream with
my short-sword. How deep is it? How swiftly is it moving?
gm: It’s not deep, only a foot or two. It’s not moving very
quickly either, though a bit faster here than at the surface, and
it looks to be moving a bit quicker up ahead too. You’d have no
trouble standing upright in the middle of it. The water is cool
and a little muddy, but fresh.
eric: Can I hear anything here?
gm: Same as before.
eric: Okay, I go back and report all this to the rest of the
party.
Bob: Right on. So as we head in we’ll have the elf in front, the
dwarf second, me in third, Alice fourth with a torch, then the
NPC and the mule…
gm: Hap says, “I’m not going in there, and neither is Tom!”
Jason: Who’s Tom?
chuck: I think that’s the mule.
gm: [as Hap] Right. We’ll wait for you right here until an hour
before sunset, then we’re heading back to the village whether
you come back or not.
mary: But that’s not the agreement we made…
gm: [as Hap] I just agreed that Tom and I would come with
you to look for these ruins and haul back whatever treasure
you i nd. I never said nothin’ about following you down into
holes in the ground after who-knows-what.
Bob: Will you come with us if we pay you an extra gold piece?
gm: [rolls reaction die] No.
chuck: Can’t we just force him to come with us at swordpoint
and tell him we’ll kill him if he doesn’t?
gm: What’s your alignment again, Friar Chuck?
chuck: Lawful good. Why?
gm: …
chuck: Oh. Never mind.
Bob: Alright then, the NPC and the mule stay behind. Marching
order as before, with the cleric bringing up the rear. The elf has
his sling out, the dwarf his crossbow, I’ve got my spear, Alice
is holding the torch, and the clEric has his hammer and shield.
Everybody agree?
all but gm: Yup.
gm: So, as I described before, the passage winds north and
slopes down for 10, 20, 30 ft, turns to the east and narrows, then
continues winding northeast and narrowing for another 10, 20,
30, 40 ft. By this point the passage is 4 ft wide and 7 ft high and
you’re all standing in the stream, which is about 2 ft deep.
Jason: How deep underground are we?
gm: [rolls] Not too far, maybe 15 ft.
Bob: We continue forward.
gm: Alright. The passage goes east for 10, 20 ft, and curves
to the northeast. The slope levels a bit here, the depth of the
stream increases to about 3 ft, and the current slows a bit.
Over the next 30 ft the passage widens slightly and about 30
ft farther ahead from where you are now the passage appears
to widen out into a cavern.
Bob: Okay, we proceed forward cautiously, still in single i le.
Does the elf hear anything?
gm: [knows there are orcs in the cave ahead, but because
the orcs are alerted to the party’s approach both by the light
from their torch and the disturbance their passage is making
in the stream, they’re being quiet as they set their ambush for
the party. Nonetheless, he decides, on a roll of 01-05 he might
hear something unusual: rolls (79)] Same as before. Splashing
and dripping water; nothing more. As you move forward 10, 20,
30 ft the passage opens out into a wider cavern—bigger than
the radius of your torchlight. You’re entering via the southwest
corner. The stream continues northward through the middle
of the cavern. Give me a surprise roll.
Bob: [rolls] 2
all but gm: *Groan*
gm: Okay, as you i le into the cavern you’re caught unawares
for 2 segments…
eric: I’ve got a 16 dex!
gm: Right, so Floppinjay is caught for 1 segment and eve-
rybody else for 2 segments by a half-dozen brownish-green
fellows with bristly black hair and pink pig-snouts. They’re cur-
rently [rolls] 30 ft away to your right (the east), charging at you
and hurling hand axes as they come. Segment 1, they charge 18
ft. Segment 2, they charge the remaining 12 ft, hurl their axes,
and pull out spears. Only the i rst 3 of you are open targets,
and only Hogarth and Groin can be hit. [Rolls] 4 attacks on
the dwarf, 2 on the i ghter. [Rolls] No hits on the i ghter, 3 on
the dwarf. [Rolls] 7 points total damage. 2 orcs on each of the
dwarf, elf, and i ghter. Actions for round one.
Bob: Attack one of the orcs on me with my spear.
eric: Fighting retreat in a northerly direction.
Jason: Drop my crossbow, pull out my axe and attack.
chuck: Can I move forward into the room?
gm: No, Alice is blocking your way.
chuck: Right-o, then. I’ll wait for her to clear the way…
mary: Do we see or hear any orcs besides these 6?
gm: No.
mary: Then I’ll drop my sleep spell right in the middle of the
crowd.
gm: OK, initiative. Beat a [rolls] 2.
Bob: [rolls] 1. Crap!
gm: The 2 orcs on Floppinjay follow him north and attack
[roll] 1 miss, 1 hit. [rolls] 3 damage.
eric: Aiee!
gm: 2 attacks on Hogarth [rolls] miss, miss. 2 attacks on Groin
[rolls] miss, hit. [rolls] 5 damage.
Jason: I’m down, -3 hit points.
gm: You’re not dead but you’re unconscious and bleeding.
You’re also underwater…
Jason: *Gurgle, gurgle*
gm: Bob, you’re up.
Bob: Attacking the orc on the left. [rolls] 10.
gm: That’s a miss…
mary: I step forward so Chuck can squeeze by and get to
Jason. Then I cast my spell.
gm: [rolls] The 4 orcs who were attacking Hogarth and Groin
are all affected, and so is Hogarth. Floppinjay and the 2 orcs
who were on him are out of the area of effect.
mary: Good going…
eric: Sorry.
chuck: Can I get to Jason’s body?
gm: Yeah, you’re able to drag him onto shore on the west
side of the stream. Actions for next round?
Jason: I bleed.
Bob: I snore, and inhale water, I suppose.
mary: I wake up Hogarth.
chuck: I administer a cure light wounds to Jason.
eric: I suppose I need to i ght these guys alone? I drop my
sling and get out my short sword to attack.
gm: Initiative. [rolls] Eric, beat a 3.
eric: [rolls] Boo-ya! 4! Attacking the one on my right [rolls]
14.
gm: Near miss. The blow catches on his shield.
eric: These guys have shields?
gm: Yep. Studded leather armour and shields. Armed with
spears. [Considers morale of the orcs–they’ve lost more than
50% of their party. The GM assigns +15% for this; +another
40% for the 4 allies down, -20% for the 2 PCs down; additional
ad hoc -25% because they’re i ghting an elf and have him out-
numbered 2:1. Total modii er +10%; rolls 54 = the orcs will dis-
engage and retreat]. The 2 orcs disengage and retreat towards
a passage in the southeast corner of the cave.
eric: Can we chase them?
gm: Sure, next round. They’ve got a 30 ft head-start, and are
10 ft from the exit at the end of this round. Chuck’s spell goes
off and Jason gets [rolls] 8 hit points back. You’re still uncon-
scious, though, because you went below zero. Mary wakes
Bob up and he spits out some water. The 4 orcs are still asleep
but it looks like the choking from inhaling the water is going
to wake them up next round. Actions?
Bob, mary, and chuck: Finish off the sleeping orcs before
they wake up.
eric: So we’re not gonna chase those two that ran away? OK,
I i nish off the other sleeping orc.
gm: Done. As the two orcs l ee out of the room you hear
one of them calling out in orcish something that sounds like
“unleash the Dogs of War.” Now what?
mary: We look around the room. What do we see? How big
is it?
gm: The cave is irregularly-shaped, approximately 50 ft wide
east-west by 90 ft long north-south. The stream enters via the
southwest corner and exits in the middle of the north wall.
There are 5 ft wide passages out of the northeast and north-
west corners, both going roughly east. The 2 orcs l ed down the
southeast passage. The ceiling is about 15 ft high in the centre
of the cavern, about 8 ft high on the two passages, much lower
on the stream going north. West of the stream there’s nothing
but dirt and rocks. On the east side there are piles of sleeping
skins, vile looking foodstuffs, waterskins, and a crude table that
appears to have a pair of dice and some coins on it.
eric: I check out the table. What type and how many coins are
there? Is there anything else on the table?
mary: I use my staff to sort through the piles of bedrolls and
food. Do I i nd anything interesting or unusual?
Bob: Chuck and I pull the orc bodies onto the west shore
of the stream and examine them. Do any of them have any
jewellery or unusual accoutrements? Does any of them look
like a leader-type?
gm: There are about 2 dozen silver and 7 gold coins on the
table. Aside from the dice there’s nothing else there. You i nd
a few copper and silver coins but nothing else of interest in
the bedding. None of the orcs appears to be a leader-type;
none of them has any treasure or unusual item aside from a
few more copper and silver coins. You hear voices down the
southeast passage – they’re speaking in orcish and it sounds
like way more than two of them.
Bob: Alright, let’s gather up the silver and gold coins and the
dice I suppose, and beat a retreat back to the surface. Chuck
and I will carry Groin’s body, Alice will light the way with the
torch and Floppinjay will bring up the rear. I assume it’s still
daylight outside?
gm: It’s been, like, half an hour tops.
Bob: Right, so these orcs probably won’t try to pursue us into
daylight.
eric: Hold up, I’m not leaving yet. I dump out my two oil l asks
by the southeast passage and want to set up a trip-wire with
an ember to ignite the pool when someone crosses it. Can I
do that?
gm: Sure, you’ve got the same chance to set a trap as you do
to disarm one.
Bob: What are you doing? Come on!
eric: I want to give these guys something to remember us by.
Bob: Whatever, the rest of us aren’t waiting. Catch up when
you’re done…
eric: Okay, so I’m setting the trap. What do I need to roll?
gm: Well, i rst, give me a d6 roll.
eric: Umm, why?
gm: For surprise…
eric: [rolls] 5! Ha!
gm: You turn to see 4 large dogs bearing down on you
from the northeast passage. They’re currently 80 ft away and
charging.
mary: I guess those are the “dogs of war,” eh? I i gured that
was just a code-phrase, like “Hey, Rube”…
gm: Nobody but Eric is in the room. Initiative? [rolls] Beat
a 6.
eric: [rolls] 5, +1 for my Dex because I’m using a missile. So
6, tie!
gm: You can get a shot off before they reach you, then.
eric: [rolls] Attacking dog #2; [rolls] 15 +1 for Dex = 16. That’s
got to be a hit!
gm: Yep.
eric: [rolls] 3 points damage.
gm: Dog #2 whimpers and holds up, but the other 3 continue
their charge and leap to attack, attempting to drag you down.
You’re bigger than them so you get a +4 defence bonus, but
there’s 3 of them, so they get +2 attack on their attack, meaning
they need 14 or better to knock you down. [Rolls] 18 – down
you go! Action for next round?
eric: I’m going to stand back up and pull out my short
sword.
gm: And the dogs, all 4 of them, will try to hold you down.
Initiative: beat a [rolls] 6-1 = 5!
eric: [rolls] 5! Tied again!
gm: We’ll say you’re on your knees by the time the dogs at-
tack. So they get +2 for that, +6 because there’s 4 of them at-
tacking, and you lose your Dex bonus [rolls] 3 + 8 = 11; that’s
enough – they’ve got you held.
eric: So what can I do now?
gm: You can try to break free next round by making a Bend
Bars roll.
eric: Guess that’s what I’ll do then. [Rolls] 18.
gm: Nope. The dogs still have you held. You get one more
chance to break free…
eric: [rolls] 64. Nope.
gm: …before a group of 8 orcs including 2 leader-types in
chain-mail and carrying broadswords enter via the southeast
passage and see you lying there. “Ha ha, look what the mutts
dragged down!”
eric: I surrender!
mary: Umm, don’t orcs normally refuse to take elves as
prisoners?
gm: ‘fraid so…
eric: Blerg.
(etc.)
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gotta remember you dont haveto be lawfull good as a pally any more. like me im ravenqueen, so im unalianed due to that is what my god is. just dont go around making zombies as a warlock and i wont have any problems with you.
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You guys are missing my point. Don't be all "oh woe is me, my highest stat is a 15" or whatever. If you were a AD&D character, you would WEEP TEARS OF JOY for having a 15 in ANYTHING. You would all make KICKASS adventurers in AD&D.
Nah, I got your point, I just like giving you crap. Hell, I'm exstatic I managed to sequere positive modifiers in half my attributes and near "normal" on everything. I feel like those numbers really do reflect me and that's awesome.
And bring on the 4th Edition, dude. I will roll anything and everything. I got eight classes I still need to try out and dozens of powers I've never tried in combat.
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You guys are missing my point. Don't be all "oh woe is me, my highest stat is a 15" or whatever. If you were a AD&D character, you would WEEP TEARS OF JOY for having a 15 in ANYTHING. You would all make KICKASS adventurers in AD&D.
Nah, I got your point, I just like giving you crap. Hell, I'm exstatic I managed to sequere positive modifiers in half my attributes and near "normal" on everything. I feel like those numbers really do reflect me and that's awesome.
And bring on the 4th Edition, dude. I will roll anything and everything. I got eight classes I still need to try out and dozens of powers I've never tried in combat.
Yeah, I'm still not sure how my haranguing of Ross ended up with me agreeing to do something.
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Ross is such a joykill.
Well, I mean, it's really our fault for having fun the wrong way and everything.
You guys are missing my point. Don't be all "oh woe is me, my highest stat is a 15" or whatever. If you were a AD&D character, you would WEEP TEARS OF JOY for having a 15 in ANYTHING. You would all make KICKASS adventurers in AD&D.
I mean, read the example session presented in OSRIC. The game was very life or death, even at level 1 and you needed every single advantage you could get just to make it to level 2.
Background: A party of stalwart adventurers, consisting of
Hogarth, human i ghter and party caller (player: Bob), Alice,
human magic user (player: Mary), Friar Chuck, human cleric
(player: Chuck), Groin, dwarf i ghter (player: Jason), Floppinjay,
elf thief (player: Eric), and Hap, normal man mule-tender
(NPC). They are searching for a way down to the ancient ruins
of the Temple of the Serpent-Men, long sought and thought by
most sensible folk to be only a legend until a recent earthquake
opened a deep crevasse and turned up some unusual objects
of unmistakably ancient origin.
gm: After a couple hours searching through the foothills and
scrubland to the south and west of the crevasse you’ve come
across something interesting—a small cave-entrance with a
shallow stream l owing into it and evidence of foot trafi c go-
ing both in and out. The cave entrance is approximately 100
yards west of the crevasse where the ruins are. It’s now about
noon.
Bob: Can we tell anything about the tracks—what made them?
How many individuals? Do the tracks appear fresh?
gm: Whatever made the tracks was about man-sized and
wearing shoes or boots. You’re pretty sure there were multiple
individuals, not just one person going repeatedly in and out,
and most of the tracks appear fairly fresh. You can’t really tell
anything beyond that without a ranger or other woodsman-
type.
Bob: Okay, the elf will go down into the cave and scout it
out.
eric: Why me?
Bob: Because you’re a thief so you’re sneaky and less likely
to get surprised by any monsters that might be lurking down
there, and you’re an elf so you can see in the dark.
eric: Okay, then, I do what he says—cautiously enter the cave
with my sling out, making sure not to step in the stream. What
do I see?
gm: The cave-entrance is about 10 ft wide and 8 ft high and
descends gently as it winds to the north and east. About 30 ft
in it turns to the east so you can’t see beyond that from where
you’re standing. It appears to grow narrower as it goes deeper,
so if you’re going to keep following it, eventually you’re going
to have to be standing in the stream.
eric: Do I hear anything?
gm: [rolls] Just the sound of water dripping and splashing
on the rocks.
eric: I’ll cautiously move up to the eastward turn and look in
that direction—what do I see?
gm: Beyond the curve the passage keeps descending and
narrowing, and winding in a northeasterly direction. You can
see about 40 ft farther, by which point the passage has nar-
rowed to about 4 ft wide and 7 ft tall, i lled entirely by the
stream.
eric: Okay, from where I’m standing I poke into the stream with
my short-sword. How deep is it? How swiftly is it moving?
gm: It’s not deep, only a foot or two. It’s not moving very
quickly either, though a bit faster here than at the surface, and
it looks to be moving a bit quicker up ahead too. You’d have no
trouble standing upright in the middle of it. The water is cool
and a little muddy, but fresh.
eric: Can I hear anything here?
gm: Same as before.
eric: Okay, I go back and report all this to the rest of the
party.
Bob: Right on. So as we head in we’ll have the elf in front, the
dwarf second, me in third, Alice fourth with a torch, then the
NPC and the mule…
gm: Hap says, “I’m not going in there, and neither is Tom!”
Jason: Who’s Tom?
chuck: I think that’s the mule.
gm: [as Hap] Right. We’ll wait for you right here until an hour
before sunset, then we’re heading back to the village whether
you come back or not.
mary: But that’s not the agreement we made…
gm: [as Hap] I just agreed that Tom and I would come with
you to look for these ruins and haul back whatever treasure
you i nd. I never said nothin’ about following you down into
holes in the ground after who-knows-what.
Bob: Will you come with us if we pay you an extra gold piece?
gm: [rolls reaction die] No.
chuck: Can’t we just force him to come with us at swordpoint
and tell him we’ll kill him if he doesn’t?
gm: What’s your alignment again, Friar Chuck?
chuck: Lawful good. Why?
gm: …
chuck: Oh. Never mind.
Bob: Alright then, the NPC and the mule stay behind. Marching
order as before, with the cleric bringing up the rear. The elf has
his sling out, the dwarf his crossbow, I’ve got my spear, Alice
is holding the torch, and the clEric has his hammer and shield.
Everybody agree?
all but gm: Yup.
gm: So, as I described before, the passage winds north and
slopes down for 10, 20, 30 ft, turns to the east and narrows, then
continues winding northeast and narrowing for another 10, 20,
30, 40 ft. By this point the passage is 4 ft wide and 7 ft high and
you’re all standing in the stream, which is about 2 ft deep.
Jason: How deep underground are we?
gm: [rolls] Not too far, maybe 15 ft.
Bob: We continue forward.
gm: Alright. The passage goes east for 10, 20 ft, and curves
to the northeast. The slope levels a bit here, the depth of the
stream increases to about 3 ft, and the current slows a bit.
Over the next 30 ft the passage widens slightly and about 30
ft farther ahead from where you are now the passage appears
to widen out into a cavern.
Bob: Okay, we proceed forward cautiously, still in single i le.
Does the elf hear anything?
gm: [knows there are orcs in the cave ahead, but because
the orcs are alerted to the party’s approach both by the light
from their torch and the disturbance their passage is making
in the stream, they’re being quiet as they set their ambush for
the party. Nonetheless, he decides, on a roll of 01-05 he might
hear something unusual: rolls (79)] Same as before. Splashing
and dripping water; nothing more. As you move forward 10, 20,
30 ft the passage opens out into a wider cavern—bigger than
the radius of your torchlight. You’re entering via the southwest
corner. The stream continues northward through the middle
of the cavern. Give me a surprise roll.
Bob: [rolls] 2
all but gm: *Groan*
gm: Okay, as you i le into the cavern you’re caught unawares
for 2 segments…
eric: I’ve got a 16 dex!
gm: Right, so Floppinjay is caught for 1 segment and eve-
rybody else for 2 segments by a half-dozen brownish-green
fellows with bristly black hair and pink pig-snouts. They’re cur-
rently [rolls] 30 ft away to your right (the east), charging at you
and hurling hand axes as they come. Segment 1, they charge 18
ft. Segment 2, they charge the remaining 12 ft, hurl their axes,
and pull out spears. Only the i rst 3 of you are open targets,
and only Hogarth and Groin can be hit. [Rolls] 4 attacks on
the dwarf, 2 on the i ghter. [Rolls] No hits on the i ghter, 3 on
the dwarf. [Rolls] 7 points total damage. 2 orcs on each of the
dwarf, elf, and i ghter. Actions for round one.
Bob: Attack one of the orcs on me with my spear.
eric: Fighting retreat in a northerly direction.
Jason: Drop my crossbow, pull out my axe and attack.
chuck: Can I move forward into the room?
gm: No, Alice is blocking your way.
chuck: Right-o, then. I’ll wait for her to clear the way…
mary: Do we see or hear any orcs besides these 6?
gm: No.
mary: Then I’ll drop my sleep spell right in the middle of the
crowd.
gm: OK, initiative. Beat a [rolls] 2.
Bob: [rolls] 1. Crap!
gm: The 2 orcs on Floppinjay follow him north and attack
[roll] 1 miss, 1 hit. [rolls] 3 damage.
eric: Aiee!
gm: 2 attacks on Hogarth [rolls] miss, miss. 2 attacks on Groin
[rolls] miss, hit. [rolls] 5 damage.
Jason: I’m down, -3 hit points.
gm: You’re not dead but you’re unconscious and bleeding.
You’re also underwater…
Jason: *Gurgle, gurgle*
gm: Bob, you’re up.
Bob: Attacking the orc on the left. [rolls] 10.
gm: That’s a miss…
mary: I step forward so Chuck can squeeze by and get to
Jason. Then I cast my spell.
gm: [rolls] The 4 orcs who were attacking Hogarth and Groin
are all affected, and so is Hogarth. Floppinjay and the 2 orcs
who were on him are out of the area of effect.
mary: Good going…
eric: Sorry.
chuck: Can I get to Jason’s body?
gm: Yeah, you’re able to drag him onto shore on the west
side of the stream. Actions for next round?
Jason: I bleed.
Bob: I snore, and inhale water, I suppose.
mary: I wake up Hogarth.
chuck: I administer a cure light wounds to Jason.
eric: I suppose I need to i ght these guys alone? I drop my
sling and get out my short sword to attack.
gm: Initiative. [rolls] Eric, beat a 3.
eric: [rolls] Boo-ya! 4! Attacking the one on my right [rolls]
14.
gm: Near miss. The blow catches on his shield.
eric: These guys have shields?
gm: Yep. Studded leather armour and shields. Armed with
spears. [Considers morale of the orcs–they’ve lost more than
50% of their party. The GM assigns +15% for this; +another
40% for the 4 allies down, -20% for the 2 PCs down; additional
ad hoc -25% because they’re i ghting an elf and have him out-
numbered 2:1. Total modii er +10%; rolls 54 = the orcs will dis-
engage and retreat]. The 2 orcs disengage and retreat towards
a passage in the southeast corner of the cave.
eric: Can we chase them?
gm: Sure, next round. They’ve got a 30 ft head-start, and are
10 ft from the exit at the end of this round. Chuck’s spell goes
off and Jason gets [rolls] 8 hit points back. You’re still uncon-
scious, though, because you went below zero. Mary wakes
Bob up and he spits out some water. The 4 orcs are still asleep
but it looks like the choking from inhaling the water is going
to wake them up next round. Actions?
Bob, mary, and chuck: Finish off the sleeping orcs before
they wake up.
eric: So we’re not gonna chase those two that ran away? OK,
I i nish off the other sleeping orc.
gm: Done. As the two orcs l ee out of the room you hear
one of them calling out in orcish something that sounds like
“unleash the Dogs of War.” Now what?
mary: We look around the room. What do we see? How big
is it?
gm: The cave is irregularly-shaped, approximately 50 ft wide
east-west by 90 ft long north-south. The stream enters via the
southwest corner and exits in the middle of the north wall.
There are 5 ft wide passages out of the northeast and north-
west corners, both going roughly east. The 2 orcs l ed down the
southeast passage. The ceiling is about 15 ft high in the centre
of the cavern, about 8 ft high on the two passages, much lower
on the stream going north. West of the stream there’s nothing
but dirt and rocks. On the east side there are piles of sleeping
skins, vile looking foodstuffs, waterskins, and a crude table that
appears to have a pair of dice and some coins on it.
eric: I check out the table. What type and how many coins are
there? Is there anything else on the table?
mary: I use my staff to sort through the piles of bedrolls and
food. Do I i nd anything interesting or unusual?
Bob: Chuck and I pull the orc bodies onto the west shore
of the stream and examine them. Do any of them have any
jewellery or unusual accoutrements? Does any of them look
like a leader-type?
gm: There are about 2 dozen silver and 7 gold coins on the
table. Aside from the dice there’s nothing else there. You i nd
a few copper and silver coins but nothing else of interest in
the bedding. None of the orcs appears to be a leader-type;
none of them has any treasure or unusual item aside from a
few more copper and silver coins. You hear voices down the
southeast passage – they’re speaking in orcish and it sounds
like way more than two of them.
Bob: Alright, let’s gather up the silver and gold coins and the
dice I suppose, and beat a retreat back to the surface. Chuck
and I will carry Groin’s body, Alice will light the way with the
torch and Floppinjay will bring up the rear. I assume it’s still
daylight outside?
gm: It’s been, like, half an hour tops.
Bob: Right, so these orcs probably won’t try to pursue us into
daylight.
eric: Hold up, I’m not leaving yet. I dump out my two oil l asks
by the southeast passage and want to set up a trip-wire with
an ember to ignite the pool when someone crosses it. Can I
do that?
gm: Sure, you’ve got the same chance to set a trap as you do
to disarm one.
Bob: What are you doing? Come on!
eric: I want to give these guys something to remember us by.
Bob: Whatever, the rest of us aren’t waiting. Catch up when
you’re done…
eric: Okay, so I’m setting the trap. What do I need to roll?
gm: Well, i rst, give me a d6 roll.
eric: Umm, why?
gm: For surprise…
eric: [rolls] 5! Ha!
gm: You turn to see 4 large dogs bearing down on you
from the northeast passage. They’re currently 80 ft away and
charging.
mary: I guess those are the “dogs of war,” eh? I i gured that
was just a code-phrase, like “Hey, Rube”…
gm: Nobody but Eric is in the room. Initiative? [rolls] Beat
a 6.
eric: [rolls] 5, +1 for my Dex because I’m using a missile. So
6, tie!
gm: You can get a shot off before they reach you, then.
eric: [rolls] Attacking dog #2; [rolls] 15 +1 for Dex = 16. That’s
got to be a hit!
gm: Yep.
eric: [rolls] 3 points damage.
gm: Dog #2 whimpers and holds up, but the other 3 continue
their charge and leap to attack, attempting to drag you down.
You’re bigger than them so you get a +4 defence bonus, but
there’s 3 of them, so they get +2 attack on their attack, meaning
they need 14 or better to knock you down. [Rolls] 18 – down
you go! Action for next round?
eric: I’m going to stand back up and pull out my short
sword.
gm: And the dogs, all 4 of them, will try to hold you down.
Initiative: beat a [rolls] 6-1 = 5!
eric: [rolls] 5! Tied again!
gm: We’ll say you’re on your knees by the time the dogs at-
tack. So they get +2 for that, +6 because there’s 4 of them at-
tacking, and you lose your Dex bonus [rolls] 3 + 8 = 11; that’s
enough – they’ve got you held.
eric: So what can I do now?
gm: You can try to break free next round by making a Bend
Bars roll.
eric: Guess that’s what I’ll do then. [Rolls] 18.
gm: Nope. The dogs still have you held. You get one more
chance to break free…
eric: [rolls] 64. Nope.
gm: …before a group of 8 orcs including 2 leader-types in
chain-mail and carrying broadswords enter via the southeast
passage and see you lying there. “Ha ha, look what the mutts
dragged down!”
eric: I surrender!
mary: Umm, don’t orcs normally refuse to take elves as
prisoners?
gm: ‘fraid so…
eric: Blerg.
(etc.)
real mature Ross, attack us with a wall of text. typical.
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This woeful ignorance of AD&D displeases me. Back in the day, stats were different back then. Characters were limited to a MAXIMUM of 18 in any given stat, with a possible exception of some demi-humans getting a 19 in a stat. And an 18 in ANYTHING was fucking AMAZING. Characters with a 18 Wisdom were immune to low level illusions. Fighters (and only fighters) could roll exceptional strength if they had an 18 strength. This could give them ogre strength at level 1, with a +3 to hit (which was incredible) and a +7 to damage. If a character managed to get a 19 Constitution, they could fucking REGENERATE.
I remember when we first started playing AD&D, the DM was adamant about using the 'you roll it, you run it' mentality. You know what this leads to? Sir Wilhelm van Awesomeface, Paladin of Kord, and his retinue of brain-damaged midgets. You couldn't impale yourself on that kobold's sharp stick fast enough just for another chance at the dice. After a year of running that and nearly suffering a breakdown, the DM went slack on chargen. I was that fighter with 18/22 STR and 6 INT and played it like he was a grown version of the baby from Dinosaurs (that might date me, a little). I was happy though, it was the first time in that group I had a character with any stat over 14.
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I remember when we first started playing AD&D, the DM was adamant about using the 'you roll it, you run it' mentality. You know what this leads to? Sir Wilhelm van Awesomeface, Paladin of Kord, and his retinue of brain-damaged midgets. You couldn't impale yourself on that kobold's sharp stick fast enough just for another chance at the dice. After a year of running that and nearly suffering a breakdown, the DM went slack on chargen. I was that fighter with 18/22 STR and 6 INT and played it like he was a grown version of the baby from Dinosaurs (that might date me, a little). I was happy though, it was the first time in that group I had a character with any stat over 14.
So, who did he shout while hitting people with objects? Not the *something*?
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I could tell you he said something cool like "Not the Pally!" or "Not the Questgiver!" but, I was a kid. I just said "Not the Momma" completely out of context.
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I could tell you he said something cool like "Not the Pally!" or "Not the Questgiver!" but, I was a kid. I just said "Not the Momma" completely out of context.
Lovely. Did you ever get the chance to use "That's a pretty good pan?"
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Res'ing this thread because it's ridiculous. Anyone else want to be statted up?
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STR:9
INT:17
WIS:16
DEX:12
CON:11
CHR:13
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STR:9
INT:13
WIS:11
DEX:8
CON:7
CHR:8
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STR:14
INT:13
WIS:13
DEX:15
CON:15
CHR:17
Hey lookit me, I'm a Paladin. I even qualify for it as per 1st Edition rules. \ o /
Now I get to level at a snail's pace and give away a chunk of my money every time I get any.
FOR GREAT JUSTICE.
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Your stats are:
STR:11
INT:15
WIS:14
DEX:15
CON:12
CHR:13
hey look im average :P I guess i would be a ranger.
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'Average?'
Average in AD&D is. . 10. :p
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'Average?'
Average in AD&D is. . . 10.
Average of 1d6 is 3.5, stats are 3d6, in order (oh god why?), so average of 3.5 x 3 or 10.5, rounded down, 10. You're also over the 'Elite' NPC Array in 3.5! :p
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usually when we play dnd the dm just generates a list of numbers and gives them to us and we can apply them where we choose. Typically the stats I got are average to what is given.
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usually when we play dnd the dm just generates a list of numbers and gives them to us and we can apply them where we choose. Typically the stats I got are average to what is given.
Mine does the same. Array of 18, 16, 16, 14, 12, 10. Fun times.
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hmm.
I could be a bard maybe? Or a rogue/thief/whateverthefuckitis.
STR:9
INT:13
WIS:11
DEX:14
CON:12
CHR:17
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STR:11
INT:15
WIS:15
DEX:11
CON:7
CHR:15
Considering my link with the church, I think I'll go the cleric route.
I'm surprised at some of the people's stats - you guys must be adonises!
I still run an AD&D 2nd ed game, and I love the fact that things are framed in. AC is from 10 to -10. Stats go up to 25 (I think some books had 30), rather than the upward spiral of stats and AC in 3E. Plus the fact that you have minimum stat requirements makes characters like paladins extremely rare, and so you treasure them. One of the characters in my current game rolled three 14s and three 15s - that's an awesome character. Another rolled a bunch of 8s, 9s and 10s, but a 16, and that's great - you actually get 10% bonus experience for most classes if your prime requisite stat is a 16 or better. Another guy built a character which has pretty much nothing better than 12 - a fighter - and it's still useable.
At the end of the day ,your stats might give you an extra 5-15% benefit on some rolls. What you do with the character RPwise it what makes them great.
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Yeah, 2e's crazy. Still, I miss how. . . I dunno, what's the word. Rare, I guess, paladins are in early editions.
You could only be a Human or Saurial (which was that universe's human analogue anyway), HAD to be Lawful Good, always remain lawful good, needed at least 13 Wisdom, not less than 17 (!) Charisma, and I think 13 minimum strength. Fun times, fun times.
Although my Con should probably only be 13, I think it was my answers to the alcohol-based questions that skewed it. What can I say, Irish and German ancestry. I can pound that stuff down all day. B)
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http://members.dslextreme.com/users/rogermw/ADnD/
The advance copies of the new issue of Dragon and Dragrace Magazine were already bought up first by Clerasil and Wierd Dough, as usual. There was an interesting feature on the anti-paladin class and a side article on a new class called a "Weapons Master," but no new errata restricting the power of any obscure and exploited rules. None they would tell anyone about, anyway.
Peter Perfect rode down from over the hill range, his horse's hooves never quite touching the ground and his new sword wavering proudly. He joined the cleric and the magic-user by the lake.
"Wierd Dough, Clerasil," he presented the sword. "It looks like our skeptical rival has one less near-artifact on his side."
"You mean YOUR rival," the adamantite-armored cleric responded.
"Oh, come now, Clerasil, he would have turned against you eventually too. Balance of power and all that. I know he would have eventually come down on you, Wierd Dough." He pointed to the guy in the white Robe of the Archmagi. "You're a chaotic force in his eyes."
"Not as chaotic as some people I know," Wierd Dough commented.
Peter chuckled. "I'm not chaotic, just competitive. Say, the tide looks a little high on the lake this afternoon. I'd better fix that."
Actually, the tide was just where it should have been, but Peter wanted to show off. He gestured, waved Prometheus a few times, and threw a pinch of dust into the lake. A 200 foot by 200 foot section of the water sank out of sight.
Clerasil was astounded. "That's a fourth-level spell! I know magic swords can't have that spell, so you must have cast it; but last I saw you you were only tenth level. You'd have to be at least fifteenth level to cast that spell."
"I'm twentieth level, actually."
Wierd Dough's jaw dropped. "How did you get so many experience points so quickly?"
"Well, how'd you guys get your experience points?"
Clerasil cleared his throat. "I plane-travelled to the Abyss and cleaned out all the demon lords."
"Likewise," Wierd Dough said. "I went down through the nine circles of Hell and destroyed all the arch-devils. And a good deal of greater devils to boot. Nothing like a pair of petrification glasses with the lenses put in backwards."
Peter Perfect inhaled and exhaled contentedly. "I got my ten levels from one lowly centaur."
"WHAT?!" the other two said in unison.
"Half the centaurs carry gems, right? This one happened to be carrying a couple million gold pieces worth. I just cut him in half, stole his gems, and got one experience point for every gold piece they were worth."
Clerasil quickly hauled out the Book of Infinite Wisdom. "Hey, that's right! A single gem can be worth up to a million gold pieces, if you roll the dice right."
"Well, what are we waiting for?" asked Wierd Dough. "Let's go mug a centaur and take his four one-million-gold-piece gems!"
"Kill a centaur and take his four 1 000 000 g.p. gems," Peter Perfect corrected them.
#
Three centaurs later, Clerasil's level went from 28th to 38th, and Wierd Dough's jumped from 18th (just barely arch-mage status) to a whopping 49th. They would have gone farther, but that was maximum spell ability in their campaign. Clerasil could now cast ten of each of the seven levels of clerical spells per day (plus 2 each 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th level spells due to his superior strength of will), and Wierd Dough could cast 13 of each of the nine levels of magic-user spells each day (well, 26 actually, thanks to his 5 rings of wizardry).
They also had an extra 12 million gold pieces between themselves to spend. Digging up another obscure rule, they found a use for a couple million of them: By using the psychic plane-travel ability, they could not only survive contact with a small black hole but actually destroy it and gain another major psychic power in the process. They each bought about 30 black holes ("Spheres of Annihilation," they were called on the open black market) for some 30 000 gold pieces apiece, ran into each one, and gained every psychic discipline known to man and god alike. These made a fine addition to the spells and potions whose effects had been made permanent upon them, and let them keep pace with Peter Perfect who had already gone through the spheres-of-annihilation bit before they'd even thought of it.
The whole group was decked out almost beyond recognition. Enough rings, cloaks, magic armor and shields, bracelets of defense, and sundry magic gadgets to bring their armor classes down to the lowest allowable in the universe, -10; protection scarabs with enough gear to give them a 95% chance of avoiding the effects of magic that is supposed to be unavoidable; three or four different magic helms, all stacked one within the other, with the outer one bearing gems of explosive proportions; rings on each finger, covered by dexterity gloves, covered again by another ring on each finger; and all the wands of automatic missile fire stored inside their portable holes.
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str 9
int 13
wis 16
dex 11
con 7
chr 18
I'm pretty sure THAC0 is wack0 but there are my stats not that i would know what to do with them or even how to play 2nd ed.
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str 9
int 13
wis 16
dex 11
con 7
chr 18
I'm pretty sure THAC0 is wack0 but there are my stats not that i would know what to do with them or even how to play 2nd ed.
Charisma is essentially worthless in 2nd edition unless you just want to be respected. There're no sorcerers or other Charisma-using casting classes, and bards are Fighter-Thief-Druids (the 1st/2nd ed Bard in 3.0 is the Fochluchan Lyrist).
High wisdom would lend itself well to being a Cleric.
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Charisma is essentially worthless in 2nd edition unless you just want to be respected. There're no sorcerers or other Charisma-using casting classes, and bards are Fighter-Thief-Druids (the 1st/2nd ed Bard in 3.0 is the Fochluchan Lyrist).
Something else I'm not a fan of in the later editions - that every stat has to be "useful" - ie pertaining to a direct plus to a dice roll for some skill gain. Just how does a sorcerer bend arcane magic to their will using their good looks and personality skills?
I know some people say about D&D that you have three physical stats, two mental stats, and one social stat, and you use them in that order ("fight us or give us a quest" style) but I've never found my D&D games going down that road. Adventurers should not be islands of muscle and spell power. Who would want to live that life of powered isolation?
(PS I know this isn't necessarily your attitude, Moondog, just made me think of it.)
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Charisma is essentially worthless in 2nd edition unless you just want to be respected. There're no sorcerers or other Charisma-using casting classes, and bards are Fighter-Thief-Druids (the 1st/2nd ed Bard in 3.0 is the Fochluchan Lyrist).
Something else I'm not a fan of in the later editions - that every stat has to be "useful" - ie pertaining to a direct plus to a dice roll for some skill gain. Just how does a sorcerer bend arcane magic to their will using their good looks and personality skills?
I know some people say about D&D that you have three physical stats, two mental stats, and one social stat, and you use them in that order ("fight us or give us a quest" style) but I've never found my D&D games going down that road. Adventurers should not be islands of muscle and spell power. Who would want to live that life of powered isolation?
(PS I know this isn't necessarily your attitude, Moondog, just made me think of it.)
It's cool. Particularly because that is my attitude. If you are going to make me do the extra bookkeeping to keep track of, memorize, and otherwise know what something is used for, make it useful or remove it from the system.
This doesn't mean that purely flavor related things are bad or should be filed off, or that mechanics should always come first, only that if it doesn't matter, make it optional.
I'm reminded of the Comeliness stat that appeared in optional 2nd edition supplements (and the hilariously terrible Book of Erotic Fantasy in 3rd). It did something that was actually 'useful' roleplaying wise, in that it said 'You are X amount of attractive. People react Y way because of this', which differentiated itself from Charisma in an important way, in that Charisma is force of personality and general 'intensity' of character.
It was almost universally panned however, because it actually did very little, mechanically, and only added to book-keeping and furthermore, skewed things in terms of point buy. Most people considered it 'yet another dump stat'.
Charisma as a dump-stat has always been one of my hot-button topics in Dungeons and Dragons. I look at characters in Fantasy literature, see how they inspire, lead, and generally be awesome and highly charismatic. . . and then at three quarters of the Fighter population, all of whom are apparently as charismatic as the average farmer, which is at odds with the archetype.
I think I've gotten off topic, though.
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STR:13
INT:13
WIS:15
DEX:11
CON:10
CHR:14
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Charisma as a dump-stat has always been one of my hot-button topics in Dungeons and Dragons. I look at characters in Fantasy literature, see how they inspire, lead, and generally be awesome and highly charismatic. . . and then at three quarters of the Fighter population, all of whom are apparently as charismatic as the average farmer, which is at odds with the archetype.
Maybe we just play different kinds of D&D, because in my games, charisma is never a dump stat, even if it doesn't add +X to your spell damage or your turn undead rolls. Characters with low charisma in my games have a hell of a time getting quests, making friends, finding out information, inspiring leadership, getting good prices at merchants, hiring henchmen, getting healing at temples - basically any social situation is made more difficult if you are not charismatic.
Sure, you're unlikely to make checks against your charisma in combat (although it's not impossible), but my games have a lot more than combat in them. I don't think you should have to entice people to value one stat over another by making it add a +1 to something. They should be making a well-rounded character, in my opinion anyway.
Perhaps those people who play the more Diablo style game don't need charisma at all - in which case, for sure, drop it off the sheet. Deckard Cain will give you the horadric cube no matter how uggo you are.
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Charisma as a dump-stat has always been one of my hot-button topics in Dungeons and Dragons. I look at characters in Fantasy literature, see how they inspire, lead, and generally be awesome and highly charismatic. . . and then at three quarters of the Fighter population, all of whom are apparently as charismatic as the average farmer, which is at odds with the archetype.
Maybe we just play different kinds of D&D, because in my games, charisma is never a dump stat, even if it doesn't add +X to your spell damage or your turn undead rolls. Characters with low charisma in my games have a hell of a time getting quests, making friends, finding out information, inspiring leadership, getting good prices at merchants, hiring henchmen, getting healing at temples - basically any social situation is made more difficult if you are not charismatic.
Sure, you're unlikely to make checks against your charisma in combat (although it's not impossible), but my games have a lot more than combat in them. I don't think you should have to entice people to value one stat over another by making it add a +1 to something. They should be making a well-rounded character, in my opinion anyway.
Perhaps those people who play the more Diablo style game don't need charisma at all - in which case, for sure, drop it off the sheet. Deckard Cain will give you the horadric cube no matter how uggo you are.
Even when you handle it like that, the status quo remains exactly the same - Sorcerors, Bards, some Rogues, and Turning oriented Clerics still dominate social encounters - while simultaneously hurting the classes that already can't afford to divert points towards Charisma, such as Fighters (who need every single bit of help they can get in the universe) or Monks (for whom almost everything that isn't Charisma is necessary).
Still, I think that's a very valid way to handle games. It might just be that you go out of your way to emphasize Charisma as an important stat 'under the table', while my DM tends to not an aerially locomoting coitus what your Charisma score is; all that matters is how you carry yourself at the table/the way you speak/how you approach people. Professionals appreciate professional banter, the gnoll tribes appreciate a 'If you don't listen to me I *will* kick you in the face' tactic, and so on.
So, yes, we play different kinds of D&D.
I still think that an attribute should be useful, or shouldn't be in play at all, though.
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Just for people's curiousity, I had two new people join my game last night. Both rolled their stats at the same time. One rolled 13,13,12,12,12,11, which puts him on about equal rankings with three other characters in the party (he's playing a human cleric of the god of holiness) and the other rolled 17,16,15,14,13,11, which gives him the best stats in the party to date. I was cut that he didn't make a paladin, as he's the only person so far to roll the stats necessary for one!
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Just for people's curiousity, I had two new people join my game last night. Both rolled their stats at the same time. One rolled 13,13,12,12,12,11, which puts him on about equal rankings with three other characters in the party (he's playing a human cleric of the god of holiness) and the other rolled 17,16,15,14,13,11, which gives him the best stats in the party to date. I was cut that he didn't make a paladin, as he's the only person so far to roll the stats necessary for one!
First guy sounds like me, second guy sounds like the rest of my party.
DM says 'I know I usually do an array, but this time, let's do two sets of 3d6, pick whichever one you like.'
I get 11, 15, 11, 11, 12, 12, everyone else is more along the lines of 16, 16, 14, 16, 12, 14. Ain't dice grand?
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Took the test on the front page and got:
Str 13 Int 15 Wis 11 Dex 15 Con 13 Cha 15
I volunteer for party (B)rogue!
edit: or if we're going by 4th ed something else possibly but I haven't kept up on it, so I'm going by the classic 3rd/2nd ed ones.