Author Topic: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.  (Read 119195 times)

Alethea

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #45 on: April 16, 2016, 08:59:09 PM »
Because once you have all these trucks you can start to make some really big scores.

Oh yeah, having a truck really affected how we played and what we did as a group.
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Jace911

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #46 on: April 16, 2016, 09:54:59 PM »
Because once you have all these trucks you can start to make some really big scores.

Oh yeah, having a truck really affected how we played and what we did as a group.

Speaking from the GM side, the Takers' access to a car also had a huge effect on how I planned Leg encounters. Not only did I have to reconsider where the encounters would be happening (Highways, streets, roads, etc) and what would logically be found there (Gas station, abandoned RV, crashed big rig, etc) I also had to consider how to make the encounter enticing enough to tempt them into stopping, or how to make it naturally obstruct their route so their options were to engage or spend extra fuel to go around rather than simply waving as they drove past.

Fortunately our game was in Nevada, where nearly everything important is a short ways off a major highway and everything else is just fucking desert. :V

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #47 on: April 17, 2016, 04:43:50 PM »
So is there a Reward / Risk matrix for game masters ?

If not, what should one look like?
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Jace911

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #48 on: April 17, 2016, 08:46:41 PM »
So is there a Reward / Risk matrix for game masters ?

If not, what should one look like?

IIRC in one of the GDW episodes Caleb said he roughly gauged how difficult a job would be by how many legs it had; this is because legs drain player resources before they get to the job site itself. 1 leg is easy, 2-3 is moderate, 4+ is hard.

Then of course you have to take into account how much the job is worth before and after negotiations, the breaking point of the Taker group, the complication at the job site itself...

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #49 on: April 17, 2016, 08:58:03 PM »
So is there a Reward / Risk matrix for game masters ?

If not, what should one look like?

IIRC in one of the GDW episodes Caleb said he roughly gauged how difficult a job would be by how many legs it had; this is because legs drain player resources before they get to the job site itself. 1 leg is easy, 2-3 is moderate, 4+ is hard.

Then of course you have to take into account how much the job is worth before and after negotiations, the breaking point of the Taker group, the complication at the job site itself...

It kind of works on two parameters. There's one table that determines how much a job is worth initially. The risk is the complication table in designing jobs, where it adds a tilt.

As the beta stood a lot of the stuff was a more narrative, 'here's some ideas, it's up to you to interpret how to use them.' What I used when planning the Reformers was to look at the complication and what I rolled for the cost and determine what risks provide enough incentive for the players to go for it.

Another issue is how you play the game. Since we hacked in the box trucks that makes it so the players can haul a lot more stuff, so they went for more goods based jobs. Because of that I made it so sometimes it was harder to move around or they had to fight really hard to load up their trucks.
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Jace911

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #50 on: April 17, 2016, 10:30:15 PM »
So is there a Reward / Risk matrix for game masters ?

If not, what should one look like?

IIRC in one of the GDW episodes Caleb said he roughly gauged how difficult a job would be by how many legs it had; this is because legs drain player resources before they get to the job site itself. 1 leg is easy, 2-3 is moderate, 4+ is hard.

Then of course you have to take into account how much the job is worth before and after negotiations, the breaking point of the Taker group, the complication at the job site itself...

It kind of works on two parameters. There's one table that determines how much a job is worth initially. The risk is the complication table in designing jobs, where it adds a tilt.

As the beta stood a lot of the stuff was a more narrative, 'here's some ideas, it's up to you to interpret how to use them.' What I used when planning the Reformers was to look at the complication and what I rolled for the cost and determine what risks provide enough incentive for the players to go for it.

Another issue is how you play the game. Since we hacked in the box trucks that makes it so the players can haul a lot more stuff, so they went for more goods based jobs. Because of that I made it so sometimes it was harder to move around or they had to fight really hard to load up their trucks.

One of the scores my players generated had a per-unit yield of 19 Bounty, so I ruled that the goods were big rig engines and they would need to rent a trailer for their car to haul them back. :V

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #51 on: April 18, 2016, 05:20:01 AM »
So is there a Reward / Risk matrix for game masters ?

If not, what should one look like?

IIRC in one of the GDW episodes Caleb said he roughly gauged how difficult a job would be by how many legs it had; this is because legs drain player resources before they get to the job site itself. 1 leg is easy, 2-3 is moderate, 4+ is hard.

Then of course you have to take into account how much the job is worth before and after negotiations, the breaking point of the Taker group, the complication at the job site itself...

It kind of works on two parameters. There's one table that determines how much a job is worth initially. The risk is the complication table in designing jobs, where it adds a tilt.

As the beta stood a lot of the stuff was a more narrative, 'here's some ideas, it's up to you to interpret how to use them.' What I used when planning the Reformers was to look at the complication and what I rolled for the cost and determine what risks provide enough incentive for the players to go for it.

Another issue is how you play the game. Since we hacked in the box trucks that makes it so the players can haul a lot more stuff, so they went for more goods based jobs. Because of that I made it so sometimes it was harder to move around or they had to fight really hard to load up their trucks.

One of the scores my players generated had a per-unit yield of 19 Bounty, so I ruled that the goods were big rig engines and they would need to rent a trailer for their car to haul them back. :V

So lets do a little back-seat game design here.

I think it would be wise to make a matrix as a GM reference document.  Just so that they know how much pain the bounties should be worth.

something like this.  I completely made up the numbers, so this is just to demonstrate the idea, not to set the numbers in any way.

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #52 on: April 18, 2016, 09:04:23 AM »
I got an idea for a Twin Cities Red Markets setting. I live there and I think one major feature makes it a novel place to set a game. The Mississippi River. In the setting detail Caleb describes that the river is the moat to the zombie barricade. So i imagined Two Cities on each side of the river. The St. Paul Safe Zone which is part of the Recession. And Minneapolis Enclaves which are part of the Loss. This has made the Minneapolis Enclaves actually a central Red Market trading hub. Other Loss enclaves send traders there to buy and trade in needed goods that were traded across the few bridges still in place.

This makes Minneapolis (what's left of it) a Taker Mecca. It also has agents from Ubiq and DHQS embedded in the populace. It is a place of intrigue, commerce and violence.
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trinite

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #53 on: April 18, 2016, 11:29:17 AM »
I got an idea for a Twin Cities Red Markets setting. I live there and I think one major feature makes it a novel place to set a game. The Mississippi River. In the setting detail Caleb describes that the river is the moat to the zombie barricade. So i imagined Two Cities on each side of the river. The St. Paul Safe Zone which is part of the Recession. And Minneapolis Enclaves which are part of the Loss. This has made the Minneapolis Enclaves actually a central Red Market trading hub. Other Loss enclaves send traders there to buy and trade in needed goods that were traded across the few bridges still in place.

This makes Minneapolis (what's left of it) a Taker Mecca. It also has agents from Ubiq and DHQS embedded in the populace. It is a place of intrigue, commerce and violence.

That's a great idea, somewhat similar to my ideas for St. Louis, Missouri (which would be a huge hub for trade and infiltration from the Loss to the Recession, since the Missouri River is the safest and fastest way to get from the depths of the Loss to the border).

I think a border-centered enclave is likely to be a major sub-setting for a certain campaign style. Working right on the border is going to have a totally different feel than a game set way out in some place like Colorado or on the West Coast.

Thematically, I'd say a border campaign would emphasize the economic horrors of wealth disparity, black markets as a response to over-regulation, and corruption. A more western/deep recession game would likely focus more on resource scarcity, environmental damage, and isolation. And a West Coast game would focus on smoking weed and surfing.
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Redroverone

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #54 on: April 18, 2016, 01:53:32 PM »
I myself would consider about a 100 mile zone east of the Mississippi to be DHQS patrolled and depopulated. After all, if the story is that the Loss is....well, the Loss, then it doesn't help them to have cities on the river that can see Enclaves a mile away.

Jace911

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #55 on: April 18, 2016, 03:08:19 PM »
So is there a Reward / Risk matrix for game masters ?

If not, what should one look like?

IIRC in one of the GDW episodes Caleb said he roughly gauged how difficult a job would be by how many legs it had; this is because legs drain player resources before they get to the job site itself. 1 leg is easy, 2-3 is moderate, 4+ is hard.

Then of course you have to take into account how much the job is worth before and after negotiations, the breaking point of the Taker group, the complication at the job site itself...

It kind of works on two parameters. There's one table that determines how much a job is worth initially. The risk is the complication table in designing jobs, where it adds a tilt.

As the beta stood a lot of the stuff was a more narrative, 'here's some ideas, it's up to you to interpret how to use them.' What I used when planning the Reformers was to look at the complication and what I rolled for the cost and determine what risks provide enough incentive for the players to go for it.

Another issue is how you play the game. Since we hacked in the box trucks that makes it so the players can haul a lot more stuff, so they went for more goods based jobs. Because of that I made it so sometimes it was harder to move around or they had to fight really hard to load up their trucks.

One of the scores my players generated had a per-unit yield of 19 Bounty, so I ruled that the goods were big rig engines and they would need to rent a trailer for their car to haul them back. :V

So lets do a little back-seat game design here.

I think it would be wise to make a matrix as a GM reference document.  Just so that they know how much pain the bounties should be worth.

something like this.  I completely made up the numbers, so this is just to demonstrate the idea, not to set the numbers in any way.



The most obvious issue I see with something like this is that Casualty numbers aren't really fixed--they're randomly generated anytime circumstances would summon a mob.

I think a much less number-crunchy method would be to keep track of what the players could encounter on a job rather than how much: Casualties, Vectors, Raiders, Rival Takers, DHQS, Aberrant, etc. There's actually already a random roll chart in the beta book that does this, though it doesn't have any pay numbers like you're talking about. I'd suggest giving that a look.

RadioactiveBeer

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #56 on: April 18, 2016, 09:58:41 PM »
And a West Coast game would focus on smoking weed and surfing.

The idea I had for a West Coast enclave is Alcatraz; the prison-turned-tourist attraction was turned into an internment camp for displaced citizens when the Blight hit San Fran. When the National Guard heard the order to fall back to the Missisipi, they realised they were hosed and went Rebel. Since then, Alcatraz has become something of a military dictatorship, where the major power blocs are the Guardsmen (rebel National Guard), the Boatswains (former Coastguard, ferrymen etc, run the ships that connect Alcatraz to the mainland) and the Inmates (the "civilian" bloc). Plenty of security but not much room for agriculture, so a big part of what keeps the Guardsmen and Boatswains as the dominant political groups on Alcatraz are their ability to launch supply runs in the city or out across the bay.

Jace911

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #57 on: April 18, 2016, 10:04:15 PM »
And a West Coast game would focus on smoking weed and surfing.

The idea I had for a West Coast enclave is Alcatraz; the prison-turned-tourist attraction was turned into an internment camp for displaced citizens when the Blight hit San Fran. When the National Guard heard the order to fall back to the Missisipi, they realised they were hosed and went Rebel. Since then, Alcatraz has become something of a military dictatorship, where the major power blocs are the Guardsmen (rebel National Guard), the Boatswains (former Coastguard, ferrymen etc, run the ships that connect Alcatraz to the mainland) and the Inmates (the "civilian" bloc). Plenty of security but not much room for agriculture, so a big part of what keeps the Guardsmen and Boatswains as the dominant political groups on Alcatraz are their ability to launch supply runs in the city or out across the bay.

Personally if I was running/playing a game in the Bay area I'd put an enclave on Angel Island instead of Alcatraz--it's larger, has preexisting buildings all around the shore, and even it's own forest for lumber. And it's just as safe against Casualties, being an island in the middle of the Bay.

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #58 on: April 18, 2016, 10:17:37 PM »
I can see that (not American so freely admit my knowledge of the local geography is going to be patchy and flawed at best). I think Alcatraz would still make a pretty good "set piece" for a game set in the region if nothing else, if for no other reason than its history and reputation. Perhaps it could be the base of a rival crew, or an outbreak site, perhaps somewhere the government had staged Blight research. (Perhaps it was restored to working order in the dystopian near-future before the Blight, and the subsequent unlucky inmates were deliberately infected in their cells and left for observation)

Keeping it in California, but looking at some of the smaller towns and cities, how about Monterery and the aquarium? Drain the tanks and you've got a lot of space to work with as a location; some medical supplies for veterinary care; right by the sea so fishing is an option, plus the structure would be pretty solid due to the amount of water etc it's built to take. Plus Monterey is a way smaller population centre than Los Angeles or San Francisco, so it's way less likely to become a horrific Vector nightmare (followed by a slightly less horrific Casualty nightmare) meaning an enclave might plausibly last a lot longer. Also, otters! Otters are great for restoring Humanity.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2016, 10:29:27 PM by RadioactiveBeer »

wilzuma

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Re: Redmarket. The ideas I get while listening to the actual plays.
« Reply #59 on: April 18, 2016, 11:06:18 PM »
I myself would consider about a 100 mile zone east of the Mississippi to be DHQS patrolled and depopulated. After all, if the story is that the Loss is....well, the Loss, then it doesn't help them to have cities on the river that can see Enclaves a mile away.

I don't really imagine a lot of people in St. Paul. It would mostly be offices of DHQS and military. There is an actual CDC ficility and hospital in St. Paul so it would be a lot like a military base town. Highly controlled, but still supported with some civilians given clearance.
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