I guess first of all I want to say that this might come out kind of harsh because it's an emotional topic for me but I want to make it clear that I think Caleb is really cool! He seems like a good guy and I don't think he thinks rape is okay or anything.
Thank you for starting with this. Your response makes me feel like a pretty big tool, but it certainly helps to know that you aren't hating me from afar.
When rape shows up in fiction, especially if it isn't handled sensitively, I am reminded of being raped. It isn't a gigantic panic attack thing but it makes me feel uncomfortable and sad and sick and I am immediately taken out of whatever story for a while.
I cannot express how sorry I am for this. That was never, ever my intention. I apologize.
It is worse in games for a couple reasons: Games are improvisational things, so it's harder to have things happen in a tasteful way. You usually identify more with a character you control than a character in a book (players say "I slap the mayor", not "Doris, champion of Pelor slaps the mayor").
This seems to be one of the general themes of this discussion, and it might be my take away from the experience. I'm unwilling to say these subjects can't be dealt with in fiction at all, but maybe the collaborative and improvisational experience of an RPG can't exert enough control over the story to handle the topic well.
The argument against that being important would be something like "That sucks for you, but you can't expect the world to change for you." But I don't think reactions like mine are rare.
I would never, ever say something like that.
So why is murder less offensive? Well, rape happens a lot more. To be blunt, murder victims aren't around to be offended.
I don't think it's less offensive at all. I agree that it's less common. But the victims of a violent crime aren't just the deceased: they're the parents and children and brothers and sisters and friends. I agree with you that the frequency (which is just depressing as shit to think about) makes rape a more sensitive topic statistically, but if something triggers someone personally I don't think the degree would be lessened any by violence.
If you're raped, at best you get pity and at worst you are blamed.
Rape culture sucks. I agree that it is an issue that American culture has not yet symbolically "redeemed" one for suffering such a crime, false as such redemption may be. For instance, I don't think there is such of a thing as "a blaze of glory," and no on holds out under torture. But this is about the perception, and you're absolutely right on that front.
I guess to be honest it kind of bothers me that it shows up so often in your writing.
Again, I'm sorry. I don't write to bother people, especially to this degree.
Like, the Know Evil episode where the women were being forcibly impregnated was way too hard for me to deal with (and it kind of bothered me that the only thing people wrote about it in the comments was along the lines of "haha, pretty grimdark"), it kind of sucked to not hear Thad as Hunter S. Thompson because I figured out that scenario was related to Lover in the Ice and stopped listening.
Okay, I guess here is where I try to "defend" myself, though I no point am I saying bidoof is in anyway wrong to have these feelings.
In my mind, I don't separate rape from violence. It is sexual in nature because of it's location on the body and the cultural shame brought with it; the act itself is pure, unjustifiable violence. When I included the rape in the pirate stronghold, I did so because a) I'd read about it as a tactic of Somalian Pirate communities and wanted to ground the adventure in something real and b) according the setting, I couldn't figure out how a bunch of flats still existed in EP. Or for that matter, people that steal physical goods. I couldn't figure out how any of those villains could exist in a universe of exo-wombs, and I thought the inclusion of that detail would place horror in a scenario from an unexpected direction (the horror of what humans can do to each other rather than the horror of TITANS).
In the case of Lover Before the Ice, much like Lover in the Ice, no one is actually raped. . The humans merely use sex as a lure, then they kill people, every time. Unless you count the Amanta as a human (it's not), the act is symbolic. I'll admit the symbolism was an intentional attempt to invoke that body horror, but its also a very good reason to kill something with fire. Furthermore, the brothel in the prequel actually existed, just as Altamira and the TransAmazonica actually existed. There just weren't alien parasites to blame for the violence that no doubt occurred there.
All of that very well may have been in bad taste, and I'm sorry it made people feel uncomfortable. I just wanted to unpack my thinking and make sure everyone knows it didn't come from an intentionally harmful place. I was trying to add realism and create worthy antagonists, but I should have thought longer about how do to it in a less offensive way.
There was a game Drew ran where your character was threatening to rape someone's wife, and it kind of sucks hearing someone you like say those kind of things. It's like hearing your sweet old grandma be really racist or something.
I don't even remember saying this. I don't even remember Drew ever running a game. I'm not saying you're lying; what would possibly be the motivation for that? I'm just deeply ashamed that I would do something like this and horrified to think I could do so without realizing it. I'm so, so very sorry.
I guess what I want is: If you're going to include rape, have a really good understanding of what it is and how it might effect readers, and label it so people who need to can avoid it.
I will make more of an effort to label such things in the future. As far as understanding though, I don't think it's possible. If I'm being honest, I knew that any mention of rape at all, in any context, could trigger negative emotions in some people that underwent such an experience. I knew that when I wrote the scenarios, but underestimated the scope and scale of the interaction. I understand that rape is an awful, terrible thing. I understand it is an act of violence, and perhaps the single most common act of violence in our world. I understand it needs to stop, as well as the culture that's shaming its victims, and as such I put it in a place where murderhobos could shoot at it.
But that's as far as my understanding is ever going to extend as a person lucky enough to have avoided such an experience. And I'm not sure that's every going to be enough. Does that mean we can't ever talk about it in fiction? Like issues of race and religion and all that other touchy stuff? For me, dealing with those topics in games and stories is more productive than talking about the bald, offensive facts...but that's coming from my limited understanding.
What I'm saying is that I feel irresponsible just ignoring the possibility of sexual violence as conflict at all. Turning all characters in every setting into neutered Ken dolls that murder neutered Kobolts feels offensive to me in its silence and denial. But the level of understanding required to deal with the situation tastefully is (thankfully) forever beyond me, so I feel like it's my only choice.
Also I've heard "It's a horror game, you should feel as uncomfortable as possible" and that's silly. It's a game you're playing for fun with your friends, not a tribal manhood ritual. You're not a worse gamer because you have limits.
I wouldn't make this argument. "Too far" is implied as a possibility in the title.
Thank you for your thoughtful and brave response bidoof. You've given me a lot to think about. Again, I'm sorry for any pain my writing or playing may have caused, and I'll endeavor to do better in the future.
